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Should you write on?
01.01.70 | Jane Smith
This is the first of a series of blogs by Jane Smith about the phenomenal growth in self-publishing.
Last autumn YouWriteOn announced it would publish 5,000 books for free, in time for Christmas. Ted Smith of YouWriteOn and Tom Chalmers of Legend Press, who are behind the scheme, claim it was a huge success: but how’s it really doing?
As Christmas approached and deadlines slipped by many of the writers who had submitted their work had no idea when or if their books were going to be published. When their emails went unanswered they asked questions on YouWriteOn’s message board: I saw many of those questions disappear; then entire threads disappeared; and the week before Christmas the whole message board was closed down. It still hasn’t reopened and, despite Smith’s assurance that it’s closed for updating, YouWriteOn’s internet management company Zarr has confirmed to me that no updates to the website are being made.
While 273 books have now appeared online, they’re all from writers who paid the optional £40 “distribution fee”: I’ve not yet found any of the titles produced for free available for sale (though authors can buy them direct from YouWriteOn). That “distribution fee” provides an ISBN, which gets a book online and enables booksellers to make special orders: but it doesn’t get the book onto bookshops' shelves.
The 60% royalty rate, which Smith claimed was four times higher than royalties paid by mainstream publishers, was calculated “after printing costs”, while the mainstream royalties he referred to are based on cover price. One particularly disappointed writer asked me to explain how her 60% royalty could possibly equate to the 79p she’s now been told she’ll earn per copy sold--11% of its £6.99 cover price.
The lack of editorial selection or advice, the absence of sales and marketing support, and the unattractive template covers have caused concern among publishing professionals. Scott Pack wrote on Sally Zigmond’s blog, ". . . how an influx of thousands of unedited works will end up baffles me.”
It’s probable that few writers will sell more than a handful of copies. In a news piece on theBookseller.com, Chalmers highlighted one title that had sold "more than 1,000 copies". But in emails seen by me, Chalmers admits that these were sold direct to its author.
Is this vanity publishing? Make up your own mind. It’s widely accepted that a vanity press is one which makes the bulk of its income from writers rather than readers, either by charging fees upfront, or by selling authors their own books.
Chalmers’s statement that they now plan to publish just over 1,000 books leads me to assume that they’ve received £40,000 in “distribution fees” from their writers without having to sell a single book. Consider too Smith’s and Chalmers’s other joint venture which is still operational, which offers to publish anyone willing to pay fees up to £1,499. And then consider that both YouWriteOn and Legend Press have received funding from Arts Council England.
From June 2005 to October 2008, YouWriteOn received nearly £85,000 in funding from Arts Council England, while Legend Press received £12,000. This led many writers to assume the publishing scheme was also supported by the Arts Council: but the Arts Council funding was provided solely for YouWriteOn’s peer review scheme. Eventually, Arts Council England instructed YouWriteOn to make clear that the Arts Council neither funds nor endorses this publishing scheme. A small disclaimer to that effect duly appeared at the YouWriteOn website, but the Arts Council’s logo remains on the top of every YouWriteOn web page—including those promoting the two publishing schemes.
Of the many writers who submitted their books to the scheme, some have now cancelled their contracts, and some still don’t know when or if their books will be published. One writer ordered thirty copies of her own book to sell at the launch party she’d paid for and they all arrived with green stripes across the cover she’d paid to have professionally designed; another has found that his cover image, title, author name and ISBN have been confused with other books’ details.
While some of those errors have now been corrected it is not surprising that some writers now deeply regret ever getting involved. Meanwhile, YouWriteOn intends to reopen for submissions this spring.
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JPFife, I phoned the Legal Deposit Office about ten days ago, and its spokesman told me that they had not yet received any books from YouWriteOn despite the deadline for submission having passed on many of the titles (they have to be supplied within a month of publication).
Just to clarify, Legend Press have two separate projects with the Arts Council to boost independent sector sales and reading among those under 30, so funding will relate to them.
This sort of "self-publishing" is really the vanity end of the genre; it equates to the same as Lulu, and is really just a way of printing something in book form. There's no editing, no quality control on the content, no design, nothing that looks at what is actually being "published". And far worse, there's no real attempt at actually selling the book, yet there is still the implicit promise that you have "published" your book so it could just sell. If you want to print your work out in book form and let family and friends buy it then this sort of thing is great, but it isn't ever going to make you a published author with a book that can be considered to be a real book. I don't know of any author who has "published" their book using the print on demand model who has gone on to sell that book on to a mainstream publishing company... and I run one of the better known self-publishing companies, Matador. Most of our authors have grasped that schemes like the YWO one, and POD self-publishing in general, are never going to get them noticed where it really matters -- at the tills in the retailers. Only then will mainstream publishers sit up and take notice of a self-published book. POD has its place for self-publishers, but it isn't the way to make it as a mainstream author. At Matador we do some POD for authors, but make it very clear that they won't get great sales going down that route, and are unlikely to be discovered as the next breakthrough author!
Lucy wrote: "Just to clarify, Legend Press have two separate projects with the Arts Council to boost independent sector sales and reading among those under 30, so funding will relate to them."
Indeed it does but the YWO website has still to make clear that the AC is not giving backing to the vanity-publishing side of the business as many have been led to believe because the AC logo remains on the pages that promote the vanity scheme.
Paul writes that his book has sold very well. I am pleased that is the case but could he clarify how well is well. Can he tell us by what means they have been sold. And as he doesn't appear to know that he hasn't self-published in the true sense of the word, whether he paid the
Five members of my writing group, including myself, took up the YWO offer and we are perfectly satisfied with the service and product we received.
We know its vanity publishing and we don't care! Writing is a hobby we enjoy; we have no desire to make a career or money from it. We wanted to see our work in book form, to have a copy on our shelves and be able to give copies to friends and family.
We did not pay for 'distribution' as we are not interested in being on Amazon etc - who would know it was there anyway so for us the scheme did what it said on the jar.
Not everyone who writes is burning for commercial success and we rather resent the suggestion that we were in some way conned by this scheme.
We are in touch with other writers who used the scheme in the same way and not one of them 'deeply regrets' getting involved.
The Kingston Five
Diana - yours are the only ones I've heard of that have been published where the distribution fee has not been paid. I did not pay for mine, as like you, I just wanted one for my shelf - I have had nothing, and so have many others, despite following all the guidelines set out by them. I, however, do not 'deeply regret' as it hasn't caused any irreparable to harm to either me or my book, I'm just disappointed that they haven't been able to deliver the service they promised they would.
If you want to see pure and paid for self publishing (
Interesting article: I didn't know that Legend Press also received Arts Council funding. Paul, did you pay for the ISBN? If not how do people buy your book? You bought four copies but who paid for the copies to go to the Legal Deposit Libraries? I think we can all agree the YouWriteOn publishing initiative is just a big mess; whether deliberate or accidental is yet to be decided.
Mr. Fife,
GBP 40 for distribution - (global + ISBN) - so if you chose not to pay it you don't get it - obviously. ............ But why all this carping and sniping at a such good scheme, WHY are so many people going out of their way to have a
pop ? What about all these nasty little slurs and patronising bollox from certain people - Good on the You write On and the Legend Press people - I guess they really have rattled a few smug cages - Ray Leigh, publisher the FU Press, www.thefupress.wordpress.com
Paul, I'm glad you're pleased with your book: but the quality of the printing is down to Lightning Source's expertise rather than YouWriteOn's. And while you feel that you "did the right thing by having enough faith in my writing to self publish", you have not self-published your book. You had no control over the production or sales of your book, your ISBN is registered to YouWriteOn/Legend Press and the imprint on your copyright page is, I bet, listed as YouWriteOn/Legend Press. YouWriteOn has published it, and by paying for the ISBN, you paid them to do so.
It was never my intention to publish the novel, but my daughter, 17, found it in a drawer and insisted. I couldn't face the depressing grind of approaching mainstream publishers and getting standard rejections so when the You Write On offer came my way I thought, "What the hell. I'll do it for Rose." It was, as previous posts have argued, a bit slower than expected, but it cost next to nothing to get a pretty decent looking book and it's now out there on Amazon, mysteriously creeping up the sales rankings. So it worked for me I guess and I'd do it again if the chance came along.
A pity that Youwriteon went down this road. I found their peer criticism site really useful. Is it true, too, that some of the top scorers on this site did go on to get publishing deals?
Yeah, I signed up for this - was both good and bad in a number of ways. 1. It actually got my book finished, since I had a deadline, and I'm immensely grateful for that. 2. It's nice to have a book out there. 3. I feel like I can move on in my life. 4. The font and text design they chose for the cover looked terrible, like a child had done it in five minutes. 5. They printed the wrong manuscript, even after I wrote to them saying I'd rather have no book than the wrong book. 6. Getting the cover and manuscript corrected has taken nearly six months, and dozens and dozens of emails, which they take an age to reply to, often giving different answers and remembering nothing of what I've said before. 7. The 60% royalties I didn't discover were more like 12% until I got my first cheque. 8. In a nutshell, lots of headaches - but at least I've got a book!
My advice for anyone thinking of doing this: make sure everything you send them is tickety-boo. Format the manuscript yourself, get the cover professionally designed, and don't rely on them for any of that. They're not interested in making our books look good - I've seen others that are frankly embarrassing in their appearance and interior - they'll just bang it out as quickly as they can. If I'd done more before submission I doubt whether I'd really have any complaints; you gets what you pay for. And, to be fair, forty quid ain't bad.
Cheers!
Loz
Ray Leigh:
You refer to
By the way, if people are thinking that the
Diana, as I
Sally, I
I am one of the writers who still wait for any information from Legend Press. I refused the use of the 'in house' covers and intend to just 'wait and see'. A friend in the same situation has accepted one of their covers and he still is waiting for information. Although neither of us paid the required cost of an ISBN initially, we have both now agreed to pay this in the hope that it will push us higher up the queue. Earlier excitement has gone and resignation has set in - we don't check our emails any more for good news. My daughter was one of the lucky ones and has seen her book published and selling from Amazon. She has a book launch with Waterstones in March. The cover, designed by her, is perfect and I now realise how lucky she was.
Diana, I'm glad that you and your friends are happy with your books: it's great to finally hear from someone who feels that this whole scheme has worked out for them. I've heard so many views to the contrary over the last few months that you provide a refreshing change!
I'm interested to know where and how anyone can get hold of your book, as so far, like Bert, I've not been able to find out how any of the "free" books can be ordered.
I'm also interested to hear what you feel you've gained by publishing through YouWriteOn that you couldn't have managed if you'd have self-published through a POD provider like Lulu, for example, where you'd have retained control over your books' design and sales. I've asked several YWO authors this and have yet to receive a real response to the question (and no, I'm not being snarky here: I really would like to know where you perceive the value is in this scheme).
As for Ray: well. I can top that one. A couple of weeks ago I heard of someone who was planning on spending $150,000 self-publishing his own book. It soon became apparent that he'd found himself a vanity publisher rather than a reputable self-printing service (which would not have charged him anything like that amount). It's dreadful, knowing that people out there are getting fleeced.
Can someone please tell me how I can get Legend Press to reply to my emails instead of sending out the usual computer generated letter which tells me nothing - in fact it just fobs me off. I have a question which requires and answer.
Came over here from Absolute Write.
Wow. I mean, just Wow. Sounds to me like those running this knew the Arts Council would stamp them with legitimacy.
Just for balance, I would say that I published with YWO and although the journey was rocky, to say the least, I did end up with a professionally printed book that has sold very well.
Of course the strength of the book selling is down to the content and my marketing, and not YWO, who didn't exactly shine with efficiency during the whole episode.
I personally don't feel as though I have Vanity Published. I have only bought four copies myself and one of those was for my own collection. The rest have been bought online directly by the people who wanted to read it. Despite the fact that it was rejected by a whole heap of agents and publishers, people that actually paid to read the book, loved it.
For me then YWO was a bitter sweet experience. On the one hand there was an awful lot of stress getting from there to here, on the other, the finished book looks great and the feedback I am getting shows that I did the right thing by having enough faith in my writing to self publish.
I'd like to add that this is just my experience and not an endorsement of YWO. I know others who have had worse experiences and some whose bad experiences are on-going...
Interesting article: I didn't know that Legend Press also received Arts Council funding. Paul, did you pay for the ISBN? If not how do people buy your book? You bought four copies but who paid for the copies to go to the Legal Deposit Libraries? I think we can all agree the YouWriteOn publishing initiative is just a big mess; whether deliberate or accidental is yet to be decided.
Paul, I'm glad you're pleased with your book: but the quality of the printing is down to Lightning Source's expertise rather than YouWriteOn's. And while you feel that you "did the right thing by having enough faith in my writing to self publish", you have not self-published your book. You had no control over the production or sales of your book, your ISBN is registered to YouWriteOn/Legend Press and the imprint on your copyright page is, I bet, listed as YouWriteOn/Legend Press. YouWriteOn has published it, and by paying for the ISBN, you paid them to do so.
JPFife, I phoned the Legal Deposit Office about ten days ago, and its spokesman told me that they had not yet received any books from YouWriteOn despite the deadline for submission having passed on many of the titles (they have to be supplied within a month of publication).
Just to clarify, Legend Press have two separate projects with the Arts Council to boost independent sector sales and reading among those under 30, so funding will relate to them.
This sort of "self-publishing" is really the vanity end of the genre; it equates to the same as Lulu, and is really just a way of printing something in book form. There's no editing, no quality control on the content, no design, nothing that looks at what is actually being "published". And far worse, there's no real attempt at actually selling the book, yet there is still the implicit promise that you have "published" your book so it could just sell. If you want to print your work out in book form and let family and friends buy it then this sort of thing is great, but it isn't ever going to make you a published author with a book that can be considered to be a real book. I don't know of any author who has "published" their book using the print on demand model who has gone on to sell that book on to a mainstream publishing company... and I run one of the better known self-publishing companies, Matador. Most of our authors have grasped that schemes like the YWO one, and POD self-publishing in general, are never going to get them noticed where it really matters -- at the tills in the retailers. Only then will mainstream publishers sit up and take notice of a self-published book. POD has its place for self-publishers, but it isn't the way to make it as a mainstream author. At Matador we do some POD for authors, but make it very clear that they won't get great sales going down that route, and are unlikely to be discovered as the next breakthrough author!
Lucy wrote: "Just to clarify, Legend Press have two separate projects with the Arts Council to boost independent sector sales and reading among those under 30, so funding will relate to them."
Indeed it does but the YWO website has still to make clear that the AC is not giving backing to the vanity-publishing side of the business as many have been led to believe because the AC logo remains on the pages that promote the vanity scheme.
Paul writes that his book has sold very well. I am pleased that is the case but could he clarify how well is well. Can he tell us by what means they have been sold. And as he doesn't appear to know that he hasn't self-published in the true sense of the word, whether he paid the
Five members of my writing group, including myself, took up the YWO offer and we are perfectly satisfied with the service and product we received.
We know its vanity publishing and we don't care! Writing is a hobby we enjoy; we have no desire to make a career or money from it. We wanted to see our work in book form, to have a copy on our shelves and be able to give copies to friends and family.
We did not pay for 'distribution' as we are not interested in being on Amazon etc - who would know it was there anyway so for us the scheme did what it said on the jar.
Not everyone who writes is burning for commercial success and we rather resent the suggestion that we were in some way conned by this scheme.
We are in touch with other writers who used the scheme in the same way and not one of them 'deeply regrets' getting involved.
The Kingston Five
Diana - yours are the only ones I've heard of that have been published where the distribution fee has not been paid. I did not pay for mine, as like you, I just wanted one for my shelf - I have had nothing, and so have many others, despite following all the guidelines set out by them. I, however, do not 'deeply regret' as it hasn't caused any irreparable to harm to either me or my book, I'm just disappointed that they haven't been able to deliver the service they promised they would.
If you want to see pure and paid for self publishing (
Diana, I'm glad that you and your friends are happy with your books: it's great to finally hear from someone who feels that this whole scheme has worked out for them. I've heard so many views to the contrary over the last few months that you provide a refreshing change!
I'm interested to know where and how anyone can get hold of your book, as so far, like Bert, I've not been able to find out how any of the "free" books can be ordered.
I'm also interested to hear what you feel you've gained by publishing through YouWriteOn that you couldn't have managed if you'd have self-published through a POD provider like Lulu, for example, where you'd have retained control over your books' design and sales. I've asked several YWO authors this and have yet to receive a real response to the question (and no, I'm not being snarky here: I really would like to know where you perceive the value is in this scheme).
As for Ray: well. I can top that one. A couple of weeks ago I heard of someone who was planning on spending $150,000 self-publishing his own book. It soon became apparent that he'd found himself a vanity publisher rather than a reputable self-printing service (which would not have charged him anything like that amount). It's dreadful, knowing that people out there are getting fleeced.
Hello Jane
It was perfectly simple. We each received an email - at different times of course - saying our books were ready to order. We emailed our orders, payed by paypal and they duly arrived.
We never lost control of the design of our books. They came out exactly the same as the files we submitted and as one of our number is a graphic designer she whipped us up our covers which are simple but rather effective and attractive. We were never concerned about control over sales as we were the only ones who'd be making purchases. We had considered Lulu but another member of the group had a very bad experince with them, but the overiding thing was that we wanted an English facilitator not an American one; we believe in buying from own country wherever possible. I would add we never at any point believed we were being published by the Arts Council.
Concerning the horrifically priced vanity publishing you mention, yes it's a shame when people get fleeced but a fool and his money have often been parted and ever will it be so. People have to look out for themselves as others will rarely do it for them.
If anyone has ever seen Dirty Blonde at the Cash Machine - wiro bound fold out pages, with images shot on location etc, it might explain why I write, design and produce my own work. The Daily Telegraph thought it worth entering for some kind of award. I hate all forms of awards.
"Ray Hollingsworth formed his own company - Kiss Production to release his cult poetry titles which are renowned for their design and typographic layout."
So, not renowned for their actual content and the ability shown in then? Sad that.
Diana, as I've said before, I'm glad it worked out so well for you. But just for others who might read this blog post in the future, there are several POD providers in the UK: Lulu is not the only choice, but it is the obvious example to use.
Like Bert, I've still heard nothing about any of the other "free" books which YWO has published. I'm interested: did you get any discount off the cover price of your books when you bought them yourselves? And how much did postage set you back? It seems that no one but you can buy your books; the contract states that no royalties will be paid to the author on self-purchases, but it makes no allowances for author discounts on those purchases either; so how can the "free" writers break even on their books, let alone make any profit from reselling them?
And it's worth remembering that a publisher which makes most of its money by selling books to its own writers, rather than onto new readers, does meet the accepted definition of a vanity press--this time a reverse-end vanity, as it makes that money at the end of the publication process, rather than by charging fees at the front if it. Coincidentally, I wrote about that on my own blog just yesterday. You might want to take a look:
http://howpublishingreallyworks.blogspot.com/2009/02/reverse-end-vanity-...
For GBP 40 you got a print on demand book available on the internet - globally - no admin. no headaches. Fantastic.
Both YouWriteOn and Legend Press deserve much praise for an iniative that at least attempts to break down a few doors.
Strangley they has been much sniping and carping about a scheme that offers an intelligent use of technology (POD, the internet) to widen the possibilities of developing and distributing the written word.
Perhaps it is the dedicated elitists and their running dogs (How Publishing Really Works etc) who want us all to believe that only a certain cabal of agents and editors, and the other self-appointed gatekeepers, know whats best for us to read - but just like how the bankers try to justify the millions they have ripped off, no-one really believes that any more.
Times have changed .....
If you want to buy a good book - go to
www.thefupress.wordpress.com
Ray, read the post above yours. You might get a book 'available' over the internet for
Mr. Fife,
GBP 40 for distribution - (global + ISBN) - so if you chose not to pay it you don't get it - obviously. ............ But why all this carping and sniping at a such good scheme, WHY are so many people going out of their way to have a
pop ? What about all these nasty little slurs and patronising bollox from certain people - Good on the You write On and the Legend Press people - I guess they really have rattled a few smug cages - Ray Leigh, publisher the FU Press, www.thefupress.wordpress.com
Jane, I don't need to be refered to your blog to know and fully understand what both self-publishing and vanity publishing are. As I said before my friends and I don't care! We are not interested in first rights, disounts etc; we just wanted to have a few copies of the books we had written for the pleasure of it. We had no intention of selling them on. We read the small print and knew what we were getting, something people should do more of.
You do seem to have trouble accepting that anyone is happy with the outcome of their involvement with the YWO scheme. I came across this article whilst doing some research on another matter but have since looked around on the various notice boards and forums etc. Yes, their are some people who have had problems but I can only find half a dozen or so which hardly backs up your claim of massive disappointment. Surely the forums would be swamped with complaints if it was all so very bad. Even the feedback here is mixed.I also came across several who were as happy as our group is.There are also testamonials and thanks on the YWO site, but perhaps you would have us believe that Ted has invented these? Believe me, I am in contact with most of those writers and their comments are genuine.
If you really have been emailed by so many unhappy writers then perhaps you should encourage them to make their complaints public rather than hiding behind you.
Ray, so you think you're getting distribution from YouWriteOn? What is the distribution services they offer? A reader can buy from Amazon. Does the book come from YouWriteOn? No, it comes from Lighting Source (I think that's the printer). So where does YouWriteOn, the publisher, fit in the chain? As far as I can see they are absent from the process, they are merely a facilitator. Which is akin to finding out your guard dog has installed CCTV. I commented on Ted's blog here at the Bookseller along similar lines: if an author wants to self publish, for profit or pleasure, you really don't need middle men in today's world.
Diana, quote from Jane: 'Diana, as I've said before, I'm glad it worked out so well for you.' That's hardly what I would call having trouble accepting people are happy with the YouWriteOn scheme. Sure people are happy with it. Some people are happy with Gordon Brown ;) I'm as happy as anyone that you are happy with your books but people's emotional state isn't a qualitative statement on what YouWriteOn is doing, and it isn't a judgement on the merit of the scheme.
Quote from Diana: 'Surely the forums would be swamped with complaints if it was all so very bad.'
The place for anyone to complain about YouWriteOn would quite naturally be the YouWriteOn forums, which have been closed down since before Christmas.
Diana: If you and your friends are happy, that's absolutely fine. I think you're naive and on the defensive but that's not my problem.
However, Ray Leigh's colourful comments are far more revealing and are typical of those who support vanity publishing. All they can do is insult those of us who tell the truth simply and clearly. Vanity publishers make their money out of writers. (That's the recognised definition of a vanity publisher.) Mainstream publishers make their money from selling books to people who want to buy books. They PAY writers. What's that got to do with 'greedy bankers'?
I would imagine that his manuscripts has been rejected too many times and that he has become bitter. The answer is to write harder, write better and, not blame those who decided not to buy it
Finally, I thought the expression 'running dogs' went out with Chairman Mao?
JPFife; Why should I not be happy when I got what I wanted. I did so from YWO but I don't from Gordon Brown. Please don't speak to me as if I'm an easily pleased idiot. Yes, the YWO forums are down which I disagree with but if people really have a serious grievance then they have other avenues such as the consumer protection agencies. Perhaps they are persuing that, time will tell.
Sally, I'm not sure what part of this you think I'm being naive about but I don't like sweeping statements. Funny how when people have a different point of view/experience they get accused of being naive, defensive etc. Poor deluded soul can't see she's been suckered.Not everyone is unhappy with their YWO experiene and that is a fact, in our case five facts.
I didn't mean to get sucked into a pointless and circular arguement so I will leave you now. My parting thought is whilst this storm in a teacup is kept going someone continues to make money by writing about it.
Ray Leigh:
You refer to
Diana, as I
Sally, I
I am one of the writers who still wait for any information from Legend Press. I refused the use of the 'in house' covers and intend to just 'wait and see'. A friend in the same situation has accepted one of their covers and he still is waiting for information. Although neither of us paid the required cost of an ISBN initially, we have both now agreed to pay this in the hope that it will push us higher up the queue. Earlier excitement has gone and resignation has set in - we don't check our emails any more for good news. My daughter was one of the lucky ones and has seen her book published and selling from Amazon. She has a book launch with Waterstones in March. The cover, designed by her, is perfect and I now realise how lucky she was.
Can someone please tell me how I can get Legend Press to reply to my emails instead of sending out the usual computer generated letter which tells me nothing - in fact it just fobs me off. I have a question which requires and answer.
Pamela Boon wrote, "Although neither of us paid the required cost of an ISBN initially, we have both now agreed to pay this in the hope that it will push us higher up the queue." Pamela, was this your idea or did YouWriteOn or Legend make the suggestion? Just wondering. There's another alternative: you could cancel your contract with YWO, buy a block of ISBNs between you (10 minimum, total cost around
Laura, I think that they're reading this, as I think that Lucy who commented about Legend's funding from the Arts Council actually works for Legend, as someone with the same name posts on Legend's blog. Perhaps they'll answer you here...!
Joking apart, I'm not sure how you can get a response: yours seems to be a common problem. One person who commented on my own blog, rather than this one, apparently received no confirmation of his cancellation of his contract from YWO or from Legend until he threatened to report them to Trading Standards--then both YWO and Legend replied. You might find that a registered letter works well.
Well, after a long and weary search I have finally found others who are experiencing the disappointment and frustration of YouWriteOn's 'free' publishing initiative. I thought I was alone out here in the darkness, waiting, hoping, scrabbling for scraps of information. My emails to You Write On have fallen on deaf ears, my
Dan, many thanks for your kind words: they are much appreciated. And I'm sorry you feel foolish: I wouldn't wish that on anyone. If it's any consolation you're not alone: I've heard from others like you. You're welcome to email me (my address is on the front page of my own blog, which is linked to just below my name, at the top of this page), and you might like to have a look at the long thread about YWO over at Absolute Write's forum, where YWO's publishing scheme is still being discussed.
I am pleased for the people lucky enough to have gone smoothly through the You Write On offer. I received an email from them telling me that my book was ready for ordering and that billing would follow. I am still waiting. Hopefully this is just a normal delay and my book will eventually turn up.
I paid the
I used to love YWO. Now I
Jean, if you do consider publishing again and don't want to submit to a more mainstream publishing house, you could try a POD printer like Lulu.com (there are several others, too): all you have to do is download your work: the whole process takes less than an hour, and you can have copies of your book in your hands within a week. As with the YWO offer you have to pay for an ISBN, but after that, you're in control of everything: there are even some reasonable template covers for you to choose from, and the whole process is very simple (I know, I've done it). It seems far less draining than the YWO process to me.
Pauly, at the risk of sounding even more smug than usual (and I'm sure that was an ironic comment on you part, because I firmly believe that an ad hominem attack is beneath you) I'm sorry to hear that you've stopped writing, and that things don't seem to have gone well for you with your book: you were always such a staunch supporter of the whole YWO project, and I thought that you were one of the few whose books were available before Christmas.
I hope that you begin writing again soon, and that your next venture into publishing is a little more successful than this one seems to have been.
It was never my intention to publish the novel, but my daughter, 17, found it in a drawer and insisted. I couldn't face the depressing grind of approaching mainstream publishers and getting standard rejections so when the You Write On offer came my way I thought, "What the hell. I'll do it for Rose." It was, as previous posts have argued, a bit slower than expected, but it cost next to nothing to get a pretty decent looking book and it's now out there on Amazon, mysteriously creeping up the sales rankings. So it worked for me I guess and I'd do it again if the chance came along.
A pity that Youwriteon went down this road. I found their peer criticism site really useful. Is it true, too, that some of the top scorers on this site did go on to get publishing deals?
Yeah, I signed up for this - was both good and bad in a number of ways. 1. It actually got my book finished, since I had a deadline, and I'm immensely grateful for that. 2. It's nice to have a book out there. 3. I feel like I can move on in my life. 4. The font and text design they chose for the cover looked terrible, like a child had done it in five minutes. 5. They printed the wrong manuscript, even after I wrote to them saying I'd rather have no book than the wrong book. 6. Getting the cover and manuscript corrected has taken nearly six months, and dozens and dozens of emails, which they take an age to reply to, often giving different answers and remembering nothing of what I've said before. 7. The 60% royalties I didn't discover were more like 12% until I got my first cheque. 8. In a nutshell, lots of headaches - but at least I've got a book!
My advice for anyone thinking of doing this: make sure everything you send them is tickety-boo. Format the manuscript yourself, get the cover professionally designed, and don't rely on them for any of that. They're not interested in making our books look good - I've seen others that are frankly embarrassing in their appearance and interior - they'll just bang it out as quickly as they can. If I'd done more before submission I doubt whether I'd really have any complaints; you gets what you pay for. And, to be fair, forty quid ain't bad.
Cheers!
Loz
By the way, if people are thinking that the
PS When I say "they" I think I mean Edward 'Ted' Smith - pretty much seems to be a one man operation. And also, when I say, "format the manuscript yourself" I'm implying in that that you know how to format a manuscript; I fear, on reflection, that most people don't know, and will come up with something that looks awful and amateurish (as I've seen in other youwriteon books). And producing something awful and amateurish is a disservice to the project and to the other authors who will be inextricably linked with these works, via youwriteon. The covers will look shit unless you get them professionally designed or know what you're doing; that's just the way it goes. In any case, if you're here reading these words and thinking of going for it the next time they offer this, take heed! And, then, proceed - 'cos it's actually really cool when you see all those words you typed wrapped in a nice shiny book. :-)
I would rather give my work away rather than self-publish (please see http://playpitspark.wordpress.com/2009/11/06/175/
). I can't see how anyone other than the printer can make money from it, and if that is true, then surely it is vanity publishing, whichever way the books are provided.
I'm also interested to know whether mainstream publishers such as Random House and Orion actually do read the Top Ten rated samples on the peer review system at YWO. I know of one author who was happy publishing with YWO, though I haven't done it myself. The peer review site seems like a good idea, though if some of the execrable writing turning up in the samples is representative of the standard of unedited material they are actually publishing... Ouch.